Does Ukraine need to give up some land (Crimea) at the end? Or is there something else for Putin to save face like what (?) they did with Wagner?
Why would they to give up some of their territory to the invader? Right now, they’re holding off the much bigger nation’s aggression just fine, while bleeding Russia. Tell your country to continue supporting Ukraine!
I don’t think Ukraine should give up their territory.
I fully support Ukraine. I know that Ukraine is doing their best to defend the country.
But at the same time I don’t want to see more Ukrainians die from this war. I have been thinking whether it is possible to end the war sooner via negotiation instead of additional years of war until Russia is finally exhausted.
Putin doesn’t care about people’s lives, but we should. I want Ukraine to win the war, at the same time I want Ukrainians to live.
If Russia gets some land out of an invasion again, they will just continue until they gradually take more and more over time. They took Crimea in 2014 and that didn’t keep them from trying to get the rest.
Russia must give everything back including Crimea and pay restitution to have any kind of fair outcome. Russia giving all of the land back and nothing else would be Ukraine compromising.
no. talk to them in language they understand, send weapons to Ukraine
Exactly, Ukraine has said they will fight until every invader has been pushed out of Ukraine. That’s the peace deal: the lethal aid will continue until Russia is out of all of Ukraine, including Crimea. At that point we can start talking reparations to Ukraine.
Let’s say Ukraine pushes Russia out of all Ukraine including Crimea without any peace talks.Then Russia kept bombing Ukraine from Russia. What would be Ukraine next move. Would they be able to join NATO?
…Why should we be concerned about Putin saving face? This is his fuck up, and he was given ample opportunities to put the brakes on before he ever invaded.
Because if you humiliate a delusional, crazy narcisst, he will not just give up. He will double-down. And this crazy narcisst has atomic weapons.
using nukes by putin would be for him just a very elaborate suicide and this runs counter to his primary objective, sustaining political power in russia
i’d like to remind you that putin pulled shit like this three times already and three times it worked: let’s invent some sufficiently external enemy, put on them blame of all evil in the world, then invade them and propagandize this as a great victory. this is how putin got presidency in the first place (1999 bombings and second chechen war); this is how he got support of nationalists (invasion of georgia in 2008 and of ukraine in 2014). he tried it again, because people didn’t like how pandemic and economic crisis turned out, so he wanted to distract them with what he expected would be quick victory; but at this point he was so high on his own propaganda that he couldn’t predict clearly what will happen. almost a decade of preparations for exactly this scenario and (limited) western training and assistance also were a factor, of course
every day putin wakes up and can decide to withdraw but he chooses not to. that’s because withdrawal involves taking massive L and the crowd that he panders to now, the same crowd that he carefully cultivated for decades doesn’t like this, they don’t tolerate weakness. so the only way war can end, is with collapse of current russian cabinet
taking few steps back and looking at the bigger picture, what can putin do?
he can’t afford to lose, because this sends him straight to hague
he can’t back down and withdraw, because this ends him politically
he can’t escalate conventionally, because he has very little to escalate with this way
he can’t use nukes, because there’s already nuclear bunker buster with his name or several, and in any case risks turning moscow into a flat pane of glass, which sounds suboptimal considering his primary objective
so if he can’t do that, what he can do? about the only option would be keeping war at this level or lower,
hoping foractively using propaganda apparatus to decrease western military aid and grinding through, trying to get ceasefire or maybe even capturing more territory and frame that as a propaganda victory. here it is elaborated in detail https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWKGYnO0Jf4
This is why Ukraine will have to completely break them, beat them back to their borders & enforce a DNZ by obliterating any Ruzzian military assets that come within 100 miles of said border.
