• partial_accumen@lemmy.world
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    20 days ago

    When I read the headline I thought about the audacity Mississippi had to spend money training dogs to sniff out abortion pills. Then I read the article:

    “An employee there had reported seeing someone in the lobby putting pills into hot pink envelopes.”

    …and…

    "Steed, a K-9 handler, arrived with Rip, his narcotics sniffer dog. Rip strode around and, when he got to the pink envelope, sat down. According to records obtained through a Freedom of Information Act request, Steed said this meant the dog had smelled narcotics. "

    So no, the police dog can’t sniff out abortion pills, instead a dirty cop either signaled his dog to the behavior, or the copy is straight lying about what the dog did.

    If anything any defense attorneys must love this. If the police indicate a dog is signaling drugs where there weren’t any, then any searches authorized by that dog’s actions should be thrown out including any evidence found in a followup human search.

    • gAlienLifeform@lemmy.world
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      20 days ago

      So no, the police dog can’t sniff out abortion pills, instead a dirty cop either signaled his dog to the behavior, or the copy is straight lying about what the dog did.

      You’re not wrong, but that reality didn’t stop a warrant from being issued or those envelopes from being opened

      • Apytele@sh.itjust.works
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        20 days ago

        And justice being served eventually also doesn’t help the person get the care they need in a timely manner. Abortions are safer when done earlier in the pregnancy, and often there are more legal hoops that have to be jumped through later in the pregnancy if they’re not barred altogether. A court case settled a year or more later doesn’t do much to help a woman who needs care now whether it’s for immediate physical safety or to prevent her body from being used for life support for another person without her consent.

        • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
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          20 days ago

          I don’t disagree with any of that.

          My point of positivity was for any defendants that are currently serving time or holding a criminal record for any narcotics charges attached from that police dog’s (and his handler) prior actions.

      • Lido@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        19 days ago

        Because judges usually need the support of the prosecutor and police to get re-elected. So the warrant will be issued, otherwise the judge is “soft on crime”. It’s never “the judge is strong on Constitutional rights.”

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
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        20 days ago

        You’re not wrong, but that reality didn’t stop a warrant from being issued or those envelopes from being opened

        Nothing stops police from intervening in any way shape or form. The only thing a warrant does is make the actions or evidence legal for future legal proceedings .

      • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
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        20 days ago

        Those dogs all operate on signaling from the handling officer.

        If there is a long pattern of dogs are signaling “drugs” (irrespective of why they’re signaling) when there are no drugs found, that sounds like a great angle defense attorneys can use to get any evidence found thrown out of court.

        • snooggums@lemmy.world
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          19 days ago

          Drug dogs being unreliable in the real world use by police is not a new topic so don’t get your hopes up.

          https://www.livescience.com/9215-police-dogs-sniff-drugs.html

          https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-03/fact-check-are-drug-dogs-incorrect-75-pc-of-the-time/10568410

          This real world effectiveness is far lower than lab controlled confirmation that yes, the dogs are able to smell drugs. That doesn’t mean they are a reliable reason for police action since they can be following the officer’s cues or smelling residual smells when the person doesn’t have drugs on them.

          • socsa@piefed.social
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            19 days ago

            It’s a classic detection theory problem. In this case, pretty much every false alarm doesn’t make it to court since the dogs come out before you are ever arrested, and missed detections are also not recorded. So unless cops are actually keeping records on false alarms there’s really no way to prosecute this.

            • catloaf@lemm.ee
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              19 days ago

              And they’d never collect that date because it would show the low accuracy and they’d lose the pretext for further investigation or arrests.

            • solrize@lemmy.world
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              19 days ago

              Why can’t the efficacy of these dogs be tested in a lab, just like a clinical drug trial? 100 dogs, 50 shown box containing drugs. 50 shown placebo, handler and lab tech don’t know which is which. Then see whether the drugs outperform placebo in getting the dogs to alert.

    • meco03211@lemmy.world
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      20 days ago

      Unfortunately they can just say there might have been residual traces of narcotics leading to a positive alert. It doesn’t matter that it leads to the search/seizure of an innocent person.

  • FuglyDuck@lemmy.world
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    20 days ago

    Well that’s a federal crime, assuming they’re being shipped by the USPS.

    Lock them up.

    • mox@lemmy.sdf.org
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      20 days ago

      Do you mean that mailing abortion pills is a federal crime, or that interfering with the mail is a federal crime?

      • FuglyDuck@lemmy.world
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        19 days ago

        Interfering with the US mail is a federal crime. Further, even in states that have banned medicated abortions; both medications have perfectly valid uses outside of abortion (including things not related specifically to women’s health altogether.) Neither the USPS nor the cop can know if the drugs are for illegal purposes without filing subpoenas and warrants for that medical information; and probable cause is going to be difficult to get, considering.

        It’s also a federal crime to interfere with interstate commerce, which is solely the province of the federal government to regulate. Additionally, USPS screen for illegal substances anyway; maybe not every package, but enough to suggest that there shouldn’t be local bastards screening them too.

        Edit to add: Screwdrivers are commonly used tools for breaking in, they’re way more useful than lockpick sets, for example, and they can be used as a weapon, too.

        Possessing a screwdriver, or even carrying one, is not suspicious or illegal. It wouldn’t give a cop probable cause. For that they need other things; this is similar. Having a medication is not sufficient for suspicion. Even having been pregnant is not suspicious; since they’re also used to manage a pregnancy that has failed for other reasons.

        In short these asshats need to stop being asshats.

    • catloaf@lemm.ee
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      19 days ago

      The dog isn’t doing anything wrong. Most of the time they just alert based on subtle handler behavior anyway.

      • Flocklesscrow@lemm.ee
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        19 days ago

        Dogs “alerting” has as much grounding in truth as a polygraph test.

        Polygraph results are not admissable in court, FYI.

      • solrize@lemmy.world
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        19 days ago

        We need an rct where the clinic sends abortion pills to some people and placebo pills to others. Or even to the same person in separate identical packages. Then see if the dogs alert more on the abortion pills or not.

  • gedaliyah@lemmy.worldM
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    19 days ago

    This is the future a quarter of Americans are fighting for.

    Now if we could just get the other 3/4 out to vote…

    • thefartographer@lemm.ee
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      20 days ago

      This is why truffles are still so goddamn expensive. These pigs need to work within their scope

  • explodicle@sh.itjust.works
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    19 days ago

    Darknet markets have been dealing with drug-sniffing dogs for years. You can wrap the drugs enough that even dogs won’t smell it.

    This only worked because the dealers had no reason to expect it.